[Papervision3D] SecondLife client in Papervision3D?

Wed Feb 21 07:27:28 EST 2007

yeah I completely agree with what Jake and Carlos are saying.  Just
wondering though, if this could be a runetime check rather than having
someone physically have to inspect it?

The tools I'm creating for star system and model viewing could easily have
the rules applied so they designer can test/try/test localy until the tools
tell them their poly count/bitmaps are acceptable etc.

make sense?  On top of that, when Fars are loaded, they could be inspected
for meeting requirements before rendering.

On 2/21/07, Carlos Ulloa <c4rl054321 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> For Paperworld we will need to validate user models to keep a decent poly
> count and bitmap data usage, and probably extend that to levels of detail.
> Good low poly artists are a bit like pixel artists that manage to create
> amazing stuff with a lot of restrictions.
>
> C4RL05
> // noventaynueve.com
> // papervision3d.org
>
>
> On 21/02/07, jakelewis <jakelewis at blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> >
> >  Second Life, hardware assist and all, still has serious polygon
> > problems. User-created content is very vulnerable to being created by  users
> > who have little experience in polygon budgeting.  Even if you economically
> > build your models in SL, you are still vulnerable to the guy next door
> > building with a gazillion polys - your visitors will experience the loading
> > delay and jerky framerates of your neighbours models.  There are whole areas
> > of mathmatics devoted to this - google 'game theory' or visit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons
> >
> >
> > Everybody wants their model to be look great, and if there is no
> > guidance, will just pour polygons into making it just perfect (for them). At
> > the risk of being authoritarian, it may be necessary to enforce this with,
> > say, a single 256*256 texture and 200 poly limit. And compulsory
> > level-of-detail versions of say 128*128 * 50 polys and 64*64*15polys etc .
> > Brutal but perhaps necessary to avoid the inevitable polygon inflation that
> > will otherwise ensue.
> >
> > The demo scene has a long and successful history of restricting the
> > filesize for competition entries - and it just seems to enhance the
> > creativity and shear ingenuity of the coders' entries.
> >
> > Jake
> >
> >
> >  -----Original Message-----
> > *From:* Papervision3D-bounces at osflash.org [mailto:
> > Papervision3D-bounces at osflash.org]*On Behalf Of *John Grden
> > *Sent:* Tuesday, February 20, 2007 12:03 PM
> > *To:* Papervision3D at osflash.org; Paperworld at osflash.org
> > *Subject:* Re: [Papervision3D] SecondLife client in Papervision3D?
> >
> > ok, I went out and read up on nearly every doc they have on the site and
> > wow, yeah I can see why people think we're doing the same thing ;)
> >
> > one huge distinction right now is, Paperworld is not an avatar system
> > and is primarily based in outer space (IE: the land you own would be your
> > space cruiser ;)
> >
> > They've provided tools for creating custom objects and a scripting
> > language - which is KILLER.  We're looking to implement world rules for
> > people to create items within.
> >
> > So, the scripting is ActionScript and you communicate with Paperworld's
> > API.  Our thought was that someone might come up with a clever weapon (let's
> > say a guided missle).  Based on the world's rules, it's fairly powerful and
> > at first, people won't have much of a defense against them - that is until
> > someone else invents either a detection system or cloacking device ;)  And
> > there you have the viral affect with creating engines, shields, weapons,
> > ships etc in Paperworld.
> >
> > We've been talking about how we can keep that from getting out of hand
> > (IE: someone creates a dooms day device that just levels everything into a
> > black anti-matter void), and we think we can leave it open enough for people
> > to customize, yet not let someone enter God mode via actionscript ;)
> >
> > Carlos is right: we have a poly limit that SL doesn't have, but I do
> > think that some of the ideas we have will help account for a good gaming
> > experience.
> >
> > On 2/20/07, John Grden <neoriley at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > :)  don't tempt me ... it looks fascinating
> > >
> > > On 2/20/07, Patrick Pietens < patrick at flashaddict.nl> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >  John,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Maybe you can use one of your clones to learn more about SecondLife
> > > > ;)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >  ------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > *From:* Papervision3D-bounces at osflash.org [mailto:Papervision3D-bounces at osflash.org]
> > > > *On Behalf Of *John Grden
> > > > *Sent:* dinsdag 20 februari 2007 14:54
> > > > *To:* Papervision3D at osflash.org
> > > > * Subject:* Re: [Papervision3D] SecondLife client in Papervision3D?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I wish I knew more about SL :)
> > > >
> > > > We've not been trying to "do a SL cover", we've just been trying to
> > > > execute what we think it possible with PV3D to be honest.
> > > >
> > > > And that is:
> > > >
> > > > 1.  Space based to start off with.  Ships, first person view
> > > > 2.  Give users the ability to create their own star system (use a
> > > > tool I'm making to place planets and structures in 3D space, save out to FAR
> > > > archive)
> > > > 3.  Give users the ability to create their own ships, weapons,
> > > > skins, engines for ships etc.  Users create a FAR archive and PW loads that
> > > > for use in the game
> > > > 4.  Use Red5 for the multiplayer portion and allow users to host
> > > > their own Red5 server for their own Star System
> > > >
> > > > I think then, lets see how it runs  and how people react to it.  Its
> > > > meant as a showcase for papervision3d and a chance to create something viral
> > > > for Flashers to get involved with.
> > > >
> > > > Make sense?
> > > >
> > > > On 2/20/07, *Aral Balkan* < aral at aralbalkan.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I was talking to an engineer from Second Life over the weekend and
> > > > he
> > > > seemed to think that SL was too much for Papervision3D (although he
> > > > was impressed greatly with it.)
> > > >
> > > > What do you guys think? The viewer has been open sourced, more info:
> > > >
> > > > http://secondlife.com/developers/opensource/getit
> > > >
> > > > Aral
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > Papervision3D at osflash.org
> > > > http://osflash.org/mailman/listinfo/papervision3d_osflash.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
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> > >
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