[Papervision3D] Hummingbird3D logo rendered in 3D

Sun Jul 8 14:32:51 EDT 2007

>Youre probably thinking of Bridget Riley

Thank you, that was really bugging me after i posted!

Yeah, pete, it will make some people feel sick... along with the inner ear
the brain uses sight as a means of maintaining balance. One theory of motion
sickness is that the brain receives contradictory messages... for instance
if you're in a car and looking out of the window the brain is receiving an
image of a static car interior in the periphery and a moving scene out of
the window.. it can't cope and you feel ill - also your inner ear is giving
you the 'swaying' feeling so it makes things even worse... So looking at a
static image and seeing movement will give the same effect and make you feel
queasy.

Collin, i wasn't aware of that... but could well be true... but no one part
of the brain works in complete isolation to all the others. The question
would be - which part of the brain is receiving the 'frame rate'
information? The frontal lobes? Getting deeper how do you remember an
image... if you have a photographic image in your head are you storing a
visual 'frame'? People remember in different ways - i did a website for a
guy who was into the whole Neuro-Linguistic Programming/Derren Brown thing,
and, while some of it's disputed it does rely on the fact that people have
different ways of remembering and processing information based on the senses
that they favour (visual, auditory, tactile etc) and, as any detective will
tell you, they remember different things as being important and the rest can
be forgotten and 'filled in' later by a witness - they believe they're
telling the truth but the car was blue, not red, that sort of thing...

Any clinical neurologists on the list to cast more light on this?

We're getting waaaay off topic here, though (although the Brigette Riley
thing probably kept us there for a while :)

T

On 7/8/07, Peter Kapelyan <flashnine at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Yes looking at some of those patterns almost made me want to barF! I guess
> I played to much 3d games (remember 3d and virtual reality was supposed to
> give you motion sickness?)
> Well maybe you can train/trick the eye not to barf!..here's how
>
> Imagine she was making a painting that as soon as she would look at, she
> would start barfing - and that is how she knows it "good"!! Or did she train
> her brain not to - over time - and she lost that effect on herself? Would
> that mean she lost the ability to even percieve that anymore (lose her own
> talent :) ????
>
> Yeah staring at quake all day real close- can make your head spin if you
> are not used to it...but I guess human brains get used to, or "adapt"
> certain movements?
>
> It's interesting to me a 2d image would make me feel more nauseous than -
> say a 3d "barf" game running at 500+ fps? :)
> -Pete
>
> On 7/8/07, De'Angelo Richardson <dialeoson at yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> >   This is very interesting. No wonder why it takes a while for our eyes
> > to adjust when a flash of a bright light hits them. Our eyes see a change
> > and blends them. I guess that's why some patterns move as an illusion too.
> > It's kindof like bits and peices of sight is sent to our brain at a constant
> > speed instead of a full frame every time. And that's why some patterns move,
> > coming from this theory.
> >
> > -De'Angelo
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----
> > From: Trevor Burton < worldofpaper at googlemail.com>
> > To: papervision3d at osflash.org
> > Sent: Sunday, July 8, 2007 8:34:08 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Papervision3D] Hummingbird3D logo rendered in 3D
> >
> > There are a great many problems with current theories about human sight.
> > A lot of artists have taken advantage of the quirks of the human eye and
> > visual cortex's processing mechanisms.... It's true that we humans don't
> > strictly see in a frame rate, this could be down to the fact that the retina
> > is covered in an array of receptors that detect different wavelengths of
> > light... when stimulated sufficiently they fire a message to the visual
> > cortex which processes the stream of data from the eye and creates the
> > impression of an image.
> >
> > The visual cortex is receiving a constant 'stream' of information from
> > the eye, so the analogy would be more like a video image - where the frames
> > are interlaced - as a particular receptor set may be firing more often than
> > others. In low-light conditions we see in black and white... and some
> > animals are supposed to be able to see only in black and white up to certain
> > distances (if i remember correctly).
> >
> > As descendants of predatory animals our eyesight is also geared to be
> > much more sensitive to movement - we can detect much more detail in a moving
> > image than a static one - so much so that you can give the impression of
> > movement in a static image if it's arranged correctly - so 'thirsty' is our
> > brain for movement.
> >
> > There's a famous British artist from the early 20th century who made a
> > career out of optical illusions - can't remember her name.
> >
> > Jon's post mentions an interesting point, you can see the hummingbird's
> > wings at certain points in its flight, this could be due to the change in
> > speed of the wing-beat, the brain is picking up the 'change' in the movement
> > rather than the movement itself. Stick insects take advantage of this as
> > part of their disguise - they sway back and forth like a leaf in the wind...
> > their prey's brain would pick them out of the background if they were
> > stationary... again, the brain is looking for a 'change' rather than just
> > movement.
> >
> > This stuff is really fascinating as it cuts to the most fundamental way
> > we perceive the world around us. We make decisions based primarily on what
> > we see, and our eyes can be fooled so easily... makes you think dunnit...
> >
> > T
> >
> > On 7/8/07, Zeh Fernando < zehfernando at zeh.com.br> wrote:
> > >
> > > >> Human brains receive visual information at a rate of around 25
> > > >> times per second (changes for each person). However, due to the way
> > >
> > > >>  our eyes and brains work, we don't see *frames*, but rather slices
> > >
> > > >>  of time, like frames on a movie (with motion blur). That's why
> > > >> it's easy for anyone to see the difference between 30fps and 60fps
> > > >> on computer graphics - the higher the number of frames rendered,
> > > >> the better quality each time slice will have.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The first part of that is right, the second about being able to tell
> > >
> > > > the difference between frame rates is sorta right. It depends on how
> > >
> > > > much motion there is. It is really not possible to discern 24
> > > through
> > > > 60 when the frames have an appropriate amount of motion blur on
> > > them.
> > >
> > > Just to clarify, that's why I mentioned computer graphics; I was
> > > considering static, rendered frames (with no motion blur applied).
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Zeh
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
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> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Trevor Burton
> > http://www.paperworld3d.com
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> >
> >
> >
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-- 
Trevor Burton
http://www.paperworld3d.com
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