[Red5] FMS, Windows Media Server and Red5 - LONG

Tue Jul 11 08:58:50 EDT 2006

these are quite possibly the longest bonified emails I've ever seen in my
life (IE: no trailing "i forgot to delete the body" stuff.  All valid email)

On 7/11/06, electroteque <spam at electroteque.org> wrote:
>
>
> On 08/07/2006, at 2:56 AM, Chris Allen wrote:
>
> > Hi Daniel,
> >
> > I will try and answer some of these.
>
> Hi Chris thanks sorry about the late reply.
>
> >
> > On 7/7/06, electroteque <spam at electroteque.org> wrote:
> >> Hi, firstly Id like to say, well done for the open source addition of
> >> a
> >> flash media server. We are wanting to move away from using Windows
> >> Media, because of the lack of support for other browsers/platforms
> >> than
> >> IE/PC, and start streaming Flash VOD content and webcam/video
> >> conferencing applications.
> >
> > Very cool! It sounds like Red5 would be a good fit. We are still in
> > the early stages though, so if you have some time and patience to get
> > things going it will work fine for you guys.
>
> Yeh for sure, should be fine, we will start small on the cams project
> which only attracts a small audience then onto the VOD content which is
> 100's or thousand's of concurrent users.
>
>
> >>
> >> I had a few questions to ask, basically is there any kind of
> >> administration/server monitoring console available for RED5 yet ?,
> >
> > A very simple web based http log / debug console (XML/RPC based)
> > implementation of this is coming in 0.5. Expect to see a release
> > candidate next Monday with an official version soon to follow after
> > that.
>
> Ok sounds interesting cool.
>
> >
> >
> >> Ideally we need to build a VOD server side playlist when a webcam is
> >> not showing and then when a webcam is on, it will switch to the
> >> stream-name of the webcam from the playlist and update all the
> >> clients,
> >> and then when it stops broadcasting and disconnects it will return
> >> back
> >> the VOD playlist.
> >>
> > This seems doable.
>
> Is there a current example of this atm to setup a VOD playlist stream ?
> Im pretty sure there was one there i cant find again loading files from
> a directory. Is there a way we could extend that for an xml playlist to
> rotate playing the VOD content and then switch to the webcam url
> playlist node when it becomes available. I see this might be the way it
> can work, however how could the application load the stream from
> another application point being for the webcam , if that made any sense
> ?
>
> >
> >> The live stream also needs to be archived on the server during that
> >> period, is there any application examples in RED5 which shows how to
> >> create server side playlists and archive live streams ?
> >
> > Not exact examples of this, but there are plenty in the distribution
> > that can get you started. Feel free to try it out and ask more
> > specific questions on the list and I'm sure people can help you get
> > there.
>
> I see stuff about recording, it seems similar to what we need to do, i
> think its via ffmpeg ??
>
> >
> >> In windows
> >> media broadcast publishing points (application end points) can be
> >> setup
> >> with a server side playlist which points to VOD content in a directory
> >> which will play the files then switch to the next element in the
> >> playlist which is the webcam broadcast publishing point (application
> >> point) when it is turned on by the encoder, so yes i guess can RED5
> >> switche to the next xml element which is connecting to the webcam
> >> application on some local protocol as with windows media
> >> lpp://theapp.
> >
> > Hmmm, I'm not familiar with Windows Media server, so I'm a little
> > confused here. however, setting up an application with Red5 to do
> > switching between live streams and prerecorded ones like this doesn't
> > seem too difficult.
>
> I think i rephrased the question a little above, basically a server
> side xml playlist loading files from within a directory on one node,
> and then the next node is the webcam stream point which is switchable
> somehow, but also not knowing how to access that webcam stream locally
> on the server without having to give the full url , which the server is
> then possibly trying to access itself via the www instead of via its
> internals.
>
> >
> >>
> >> Our other question was regarding logging, I noticed log4j is the
> >> logger
> >> of choice, which is a great tool, ive used that aswell as log4net. Is
> >> it able to use W3C style formatting, which is then easily parsable
> >> using the LogParser library for .NET ? This will mean there is not
> >> much
> >> migration required with our current setup which parses windows media
> >> logs in W3C format for collecting bandwidth used from each publishing
> >> point (stream name/ application).
> >>
> > Not sure about this. Sorry.
>
> Ill consult the log4j docs, LogParser can handle other formats than W3C
> also.
>
> >>
> > We are working on security and these types of concerns in the 0.6
> > release. Please tell us more about what you are looking for, and
> > hopefully we can add it.
>
> I'll probably revisit security concerns when we start on the VOD
> project so ill return to this question later.
>
> >>
> >
> > We are stuck using RTMP and delivering to the Flash player too, so I'm
> > not sure if we can improve upon this. However, I'm by no means an
> > expert on RTMP and FLV media, so I think this is best left to Luke,
> > Steven or Joachim to answer.
>
> Sure not a problem.
>
> >
> >>
> >> We offer free and paid services, so obviously the free stuff isn't a
> >> problem, but being able to packet sniff exposed information in flash
> >> makes you wonder.
> >>
> >> Im sorry about the long set of questions, it was needed, as we've had
> >> to ditch Adobe being they were rude and arrogant in returning
> >> technical
> >> information like my questions above and sales quotes to a possible
> >> customer which they have lost.
> >
> > Wow, I'm sorry to hear that. I am glad however, that you are
> > considering using Red5.
>
> Yes, it is rather unfortunate, however we may be looking currently at
> purchasing flex builder2 off them (unfortunately) as the plugin
> versions dont seem to load on eclipse 3.1 on osx ;) I can still use the
> free SDK compiler and ANT, but we need to build a broadcaster app
> interface fairly quickly, so could lend on its designer, which will
> interface with custom AS classes/packages etc. I will probably revisit
> my previous workings with mtasc and swfmill however im nervy abouts its
> future versions not supporting AS3 rather a specialized psuedo
> language.
>
> >
> >>
> >> My preference is to support open source firstly at all times, I can
> >> even convince my boss to donate a fair sum of money if he is happy
> >> with
> >> it considering the stupid license for FMS.
> >
> > Great! We aren't currently setup to accept donations, but this is
> > something that we will be addressing very soon.
>
> Ok ill let you know.
>
> >
> >> My boss is fascinating over
> >> Adobe's origin/edge load balanced FMS systems, would there be an easy
> >> way to kludge something similar in RED5 using a load balancer to a few
> >> machines accessing a shared network drive on a video content server
> >> for
> >> the content etc ?
> >
> > Load balancing schemes are certainly in the works and we hope to have
> > solutions or at the very least recommendations on how to do it soon.
>
> Ok ill revisit this question soon. Even just two servers loading VOD
> content off a single VOD content server, might be sufficient rather
> than applications on each server proxying to the main application on
> the VOD content server and caching the requests, however caching might
> be valuable also.
>
> >
> >>
> >> Let me know, and sorry about the essay thanks.
> >>
> >
> > Well I appreciate your well thought out questions. Perhaps others can
> > learn from this as well. That's the whole idea behind the mailing list
> > anyway.
>
> OK, not a problem, see Ive already begun to respect the people on this
> list, as I got responses to a fairly detailed technical essay,
> something not even the techs at adobe could bother to come up with.
>
> I have extensive knowledge in the windows media side of things, aswell
> as real streaming and quicktime so maybe if I manage to replicate what
> most of them do into applications I could document it and also share
> knowledge about what they do in general. However I hear there are
> already modules becoming available to achieve most things the windows
> media server is capable of.
>
> Dan
>
>
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>

-- 
John Grden
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