[Red5] webapps
Walter Tak
walter at waltertak.com
Tue Aug 11 08:28:21 PDT 2009
Yep and that's why some of us take the time to explains things, give tips, help people with their common problems and don't evade discussions on the subject.
We don't mind to help as long as the tone of questions and remarks has a friendly nature. Often people using open-source software expect it to work as normal commercial software with a lot of support and automated tasks. Red5 isn't intended that way however it's listening to it's users and will probably in the end outgrow commercial (closedsource) projects like Wowza and FMS simple due to the sheer number of enthousiast developers and users.
The aspect of buying 10 FMS licenses for 45k USD versus zilch with Red5 also might interest demanding customers with large-scale projects. You can nearly hire
a very good developer for 6 months for such an amount. Needless to say you'll end up with a perfectly written custom-application and neatly installed and configured server where you'd only have 10 paper licenses and a DVD if you'd go for FMS :)
Think of Linux, Apache, Mysql, PHP and not to forget Java. It took a few years to reach the maturity it has right now. Red5 still is relative young.
I wasn't complaining. I'm making do with what I got. I'm streaming videos on my site so I'm happy. I'm currently at the point that I would like to expand the streaming to multiple channels so that's why I was asking for help. If I had the budget to hire a developer perhaps I would do that or spend the 4.5k on FMS. I prefer red5 because I like what's being done and think FMS is a joke.
"I get by with a little help from my friends" - Beatles lol
From: red5-bounces at osflash.org [mailto:red5-bounces at osflash.org] On Behalf Of Walter Tak
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 8:57 AM
To: red5 at osflash.org
Subject: Re: [Red5] webapps
Imho applications should be written and developed by developers and not admins. You are sitting on the seat of a programmer and yes that's hard since it's a different ballgame.
It's like ranting about how difficult "SQL stored-procedures" and "PHP oop-coding with MVC-frameworks" are when you are only the maintainer/admin of a Linux box ; maintenance is not the same as development. Besides that there are many people around that can explain in a few hours how to maintain a Red5 box regarding setup, performance, security, maintenance, common pitfalls etc. This list is full of advice, tips and solutions to most common problems.
You'd encounter the same problem if you were asked to setup and maintain a Tomcat webserver and custom java-servlets. Or JBoss, or Websphere or <fill in another application-server>. Even FMS and Wowza aren't installable and maintainable without any knowlegde. Let alone that you'd be able to develop a decent server-sided application for FMS or Wowza. FMS still uses a downgraded version of ActionScript v1.5 and Wowza also has server-sided Java. Both have their quirks. If you don't know ActionScript 1.5 nor Java then you'd still come to a grinding halt while trying to setup those products, the problems (or challenges) are similar to the ones you experienced with Red5.
Perhaps you miss examples like the shiny FMS examples like http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flashmediaserver/articles/video_sharing_web_app.html but really ; there are many of those examples available for Red5 you only have to Google around a bit, or ask a simple question on this list.
You can pay around 4500 USD for (one!) FMS interactive server. Imagine you'd spend 4500 USD on learning how to use Red5. No doubt you've learned everything you want and should know where you still wouldn't know a lot after buying FMS IS ; it certainly won't develop and maintain applications by itself :)
W.
----- Original Message -----
From: AMP Admin
To: red5 at osflash.org
Sent: Monday, 10 August 2009 22:13
Subject: Re: [Red5] webapps
Nor do I Mike,
I actually ranted about this some months ago on this list. There were some very good replies. Red5 is great but it's hard on everyday system admin or anyone else that just doesn't know java. Right now we just have to tough it out and work with whatever help we can get.
We can keep our fingers crossed and hope that it gets to the point that we can easily work with it so FMS doesn't try and rape us anymore.
Thank you and good luck as well.
From: red5-bounces at osflash.org [mailto:red5-bounces at osflash.org] On Behalf Of Michael Fleming
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 3:06 PM
To: red5 at osflash.org
Subject: Re: [Red5] webapps
AMP Admin -
I too was very surprised and a bit disappointed that I will unlikely be able to fully utilize Red5 without learning Java and the Red5 architecture to a depth I had never anticipated.
Hopefully, as time goes on, more tools will be written to allow the casual Red5 user (or hardcore AS3 developer) to easily configure and setup Red5 webapps. Until then, you and I and everyone else that goes down this path will need to learn Java. To me, Java syntax is not the biggest challenge.. the biggest challenge is that the architecture and underlying technology are all unfamiliar - and that's just Java. Red5 is a whole layer of learing on top of that. Good luck and hopefully we can learn from each other and the experts in this list.
I do not know enough yet to even attempt what Walter wrote. A step-by-step tutorial would indeed be useful. I have no idea how Java is done or how to compile it or work with it yet, much less do that within the complexities of Red5. I seriously thought Red5 was a drop-in plug 'n play alternative to FMS two months ago.
Right now, I like you, am just living with 'oflaDemo'. It does everything I need for now.
- Mike (aka Vortran)
AMP Admin wrote:
Thank you for your reply!
I'm sorry, I always feel like I'm a lot to deal with when I message this list due to my very limited java coding knowledge. Say we wanted to duplicate and rename oflaDemo. how hard is that? I don't have the source or a compiler to change anything that was hardcoded. Is it possible to duplicate, rename, and edit xml files or something?
I don't suppose you want to give a walk through using oflaDemo or playlistTest as an example? Lol
From: red5-bounces at osflash.org [mailto:red5-bounces at osflash.org] On Behalf Of Walter Tak
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 9:07 AM
To: red5 at osflash.org
Subject: Re: [Red5] webapps
Yes and no ;
you can make a copy and edit the configuration files (properties, xml, logback) but one thing is hardcoded inside an application: the name of the app for the logging.
So you need to change 1 line of code inside your Application.java/class , recompile and redeploy.
There is a one-time fix for this: Do not compile the name of your application inside your application.
Workaround:
Set the name of the logger in file [red5-web.xml] like:
<bean id="web.handler" class="loadtest.Application"> <property name="applicationId" value="loadtest" /> </bean>The name of the class can be just "Application" or "com.yourcompany.this.that.Application" etc.
Next add a getter and a setter to your file [Application.java]:
private String sNameOfMyApp = "default"; // this private string will be filled by the setter method and read by the getter method.
// setter
public void setApplicationId(String sId) {
sNameOfMyApp = sId;
log = Red5LoggerFactory.getLogger(Application.class, sNameOfMyApp);
log.info("[E] setApplicationId: " + sId + " is starting.");
}
// getter
public String getApplicationId() {
return sNameOfMyApp;
}
The setter will be called before [appStart] and thus initialize the logger with the external parameter.
Example output in my log [./log/loadtest.log]:
2009-08-10 15:59:41,234 [main] DEBUG root - Starting up context loadtest
2009-08-10 15:59:41,484 [Launcher:/loadtest] INFO loadtest.Application - [E] setApplicationId: loadtest is starting.
2009-08-10 15:59:41,484 [Launcher:/loadtest] INFO loadtest.Application - [E] appStart: loadtest is starting.
Snippet from Application.java:
public boolean appStart(IScope iscope_application) {
log.info("[E] appStart: " + sNameOfMyApp + " is starting.");
...
Just tested this and it works. I recommend this to use in the examples about logging. It's very flexible since it removes the hard-coded name of the application to be used for logging.
W.
----- Original Message -----
From: AMP Admin
To: red5 at osflash.org
Sent: Monday, 10 August 2009 15:33
Subject: [Red5] webapps
Sorry if this is a dumb question but can we duplicate a directory/app and rename it in webapps? Like if we have a streaming app and we want to create another one that does the same thing but with a different name.
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